BERNARD RAMSEY                                       Actual Military Records
quote

E4 RAMSEY BERNARD JR got out of the Air Force on 20 April 1972.  He did not serve in Vietnam.  His MOS was 30630 which was Apprentice Electronic Communications and Cryptographic Equipment Systems Repairman.

end quote

Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 7:22 AM
Subject: Fw: Cocktails and Dinner to Honor Bernie Ramsey, Saturday, July 29 starting at 4:30 PM in Annapolis, MD

Please see attached dedication & dinner ceremony in Honor of the late Bernie Ramsey:

Bernard Ramsey
Defender of Freedom             
June 19, 1942 to May 16, 2003

 ”A Window of Hope for U.S. POWs in Laos, Cambodia, and Vietnam” –  Bernie
 Ramsey, a native born Hawaiian, served during the Vietnam War both for the
 U.S. Air Force and the U.S. Army special forces – where his missions were
 largely unrecorded and therefore unofficial (the United States was never
 officially in Laos or Cambodia during the Vietnam conflict). Ramsey and his
 special forces executed special operations, including the transportation of
 “gold chits” to South East Asia “friendlies” who were therein encouraged to
 help and protect United States servicemen trapped behind enemy lines.

 Bernie was the Master Instructor for Computer Systems and Cryptographic
 Systems Technology for the 3380th Communications Squadron at Keesler Air
 Force Base.  Bernie met his lovely wife “T” during his two tours in Japan
 (2152nd Communications Squadron at Kadena and the 1962nd Communications
 Group – Kadena).  Bernie also served as the Information System Automation
 Engineer at Tempelhof Central Airport, Berlin, Germany, where he and his
 wife raised their daughter Monica.  Other military assignments included the
 91st Communications Squadron and the 862nd at Minot Air Force Base in North
 Dakota, as well as the 1st Aerial Port Squadron, Lockbourne Air Force Base
 – Ohio.

 It was Bernie’s final tour of duty in South East Asia that made his name a
 household word.  He served with Special Forces, starting with the Combat
 Control Team of Fort Benning, Georgia.  His actions extracted or assisted
 in the extraction of approximately 179 U.S. prisoners of war from behind
 enemy lines in South Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia.  He and his team became a
 single window of hope for U.S. servicemen captured or trapped in harm’s
 way. In the height of conflict, “Ramsey to the Rescue” was the common cry
 for this special elite mission group. Many believe that his team’s heroic
 work was glamorized by a motion picture that bears a similar name to his –
 it reminds us all that America does not abandon its fighting forces. As
 Bernard Ramsey provided a window of hope for American servicemen, we are
 dedicating in his honor these windows of light to American Legion Post 7,
 with the hope that his sterling record will continue to inspire veterans
 for the centuries to come.

Department of Defense Public Record

USAF
Name :  BERNARD JR RAMSEY
Service :  AIR FORCE
Service Component :  REGULAR
Pay Grade :  E-6
Military Specialty :  T30671
Home of Record :  Unknown
Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 16:42:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sherman Stephen
Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Question
Doesn't come up in my database. Doesn't sound quite kosher to me.
 ...... Another common feature of false POW stories is a claim to have been freed in a dramatic rescue by US Navy Seals, Special Forces, or other elite unit. US forces made many, many heroic rescues of downed airmen and other Americans in desperate situations. They also carried out many operations aimed at rescuing American POWs from prison camps; however, the only rescue operation that freed an American POW from captivity was a July 1969 operation by Republic of Vietnam Armed Forces (RVNAF) troops from a Regional Forces unit, a Provincial Reconnaissance Unit, and the Reconnaissance Company of the Army of the Republic of Vietnam (ARVN) 5th Regiment. Unfortunately, the freed American died a short time later from injuries a guard inflicted on him before rescuers could reach him. US forces carried out several operations that led to the rescue of  the crews and passengers of downed American aircraft who were evading capture. The movie "BAT 21" is based on one such incident. US forces also took part in several operations that led to the rescue of RVNAF prisoners from POW camps. For example, Operation Cranberry Bog in August 1968 led to the rescue of 45 ARVN POWs. In another example, a US Navy SEAL, Richard G. Couch, led a successful rescue of 19 ARVN prisoners.  Also, there were instances in which American forces accidentally happened upon Americans who were trying to escape from captivity and rescued them. The most famous of these incidents was the rescue of US Army 1st Lieutenant James N. Rowe on 31 December 1968 (see book entitled "Five Years to Freedom," by James N. Rowe, Ballantine Books, paperback edition 1984, available on line from Barnes and Noble). In another incident, a helicopter crew rescued Army Sgt. Wm. Taylor on May 6, 1968.  A force of armed helicopters attacked a guerrilla camp with machine guns and rockets, unaware that Sgt Taylor was in the camp. Sgt Taylor, who was still recovering from a compound fracture to one leg, a shattered knee, and numerous abrasions and burns he suffered in an air crash on 20 March 1968, received additional wounds from one of the rockets; yet he still managed to take advantage of the confusion during the air attack to crawl out of the camp and into a clearing where he signaled the crew of one of the helicopters. While there were many heroic rescues of downed airmen and other Americans from difficult situations, there were no other dramatic rescues of Americans from POW camps.

Captain John "Mike" McGrath, USN (Ret) at: e-mail mmcgrath@iex.net     
Mike is the Historian for NAM-POWs, Inc.  He was a POW for 5 years 9 months. 

.... "As you will note, while this person served honorably in the Air Force, there are none of the assignments which have ascribed to him and none of the high-profile medals that he claimed to have received.
 
"While there may have been a short tour of duty in Vietnam, there is no record of him being assigned to a prisoner-release-team as he claimed and no record of him being assigned to the Army Special Forces in a similar capacity.  It is also extremely unlikely that a person with this person's training would have conducted such high-risk assignments.

"This person's assignments range from 1964 when he was an airman recruit, and assigned as a cook; to 1965 when he was a cook while awaiting training as an air-traffic-controller in 1967; to 1969 when he was assigned in Ohio as an air-traffic-controller;  to 1970-71 when he was assigned as a Crypto Maintenance Technician in Texas; to 1972 when he retired from the Air Force.

 
"With this record in mind, it would have been difficult for him to have found the time to have "extracted approximately 179 U.S. servicemen from behind enemy lines in Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia. He even had problems getting his retirement because it was so difficult to track his classified military record."  Apparently there was no such difficulty, because his entire history and  is recorded in these records.  Additionally, he did not have sufficient time in the service to have been "retired."  He spent a total of eight years in the Air Force while retirement, unless there is a major disability, requires a minimum of twenty years of service. ...

Michael

.Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 8:14 AM

.. 3)  Mr. Ramsey's activities during the Vietnam War were

> apparently not declassified until after his relatively recent death.  At
> his funeral at Arlington National Cemetary (a location and institution
> which I understand you are directly associated with), official
> representatives of the Department of Defense read portions of his
> formerly classified service record -- and it was at that point that I
> realized that this quiet unassuming individual actually LIVED the great
> American Veteran principle of "NO TROOPS LEFT BEHIND".  In this day and
> age of foreign governments saying that there is nothing unique about
> American veterans, this principle is one of many we at the American
> Legion wish to honor out of respect for our proud traditions.  I very
> much appreciate the material you just sent me, but having been a
> government-type for twenty years, I also recognize when something is left
> out of a transcript or record -- please note that on the NA Form 13164
> (Rev 02-02) second page at the bottom where the transcript reads "For
> Deceased Veteran Only", that the record says "NA" for Date of Death,
> Location of Death, and Place of Burial.  Since you and I BOTH know that
> Bernard is dead, and that he was buried at Arlington National Cemetary,
> it should be clear to BOTH of us that this report is the NOT classified
> version - it doesn't even take into account that he is deceased!  The
> material read at his funeral prior to or after the gun salutes included
> the formerly classified assignments that were not declassified until his
> death.  I was one of about 40 individuals at this funeral, and if it
> would ease your mind any, I can list about 20 NON-relatives that heard
> the same record I heard - should you wish to pursue this further.
>         4)  At the ceremony we held in Annapolis on the day AFTER the
> news article, an extremely high ranking government official (who IS still
> in a classified status) revealed to the 60 or so attendees (which
> included, by the way, representatives from several congressional and
> senatorial offices, but NO news media at the actual event) that he
> himself had been rescued by Mr. Ramsey and his team.  He stated that he
> had been shot, was for four days bleeding and ultimately unconscious
> behind enemy lines in Cambodia, knowing he was dead to the world, and
> then awoke sometime later in a U.S. service hospital -- not knowing
> anything about who or how he had been rescued.  As this gentleman later
> rose in the ranks of the government and received access to classified
> records, he made it a point to find out who had saved him.  He stated
> that it was Mr. Ramsey and his team, and it developed into a lifetime
> friendship.  This gentleman stated that had it not been for the tradition
> of "No Troops Left Behind" that Mr. Ramsey and his team lived by, then
> this gentleman would have no children, nor would he have the many
> grandchildren he now has, nor would he have had over 40 years of
> government service.  Maybe, he stated, one of his grandchildren or great
> grandchildren will be the next great U.S. President, or the scientist
> that cures Cancer - but none of it would have happened if Bernie Ramsey
> had not rescued him. There was not a dry eye in the Post when this
> gentleman told his story.  Knowing this gentleman's very high status in
> classified operations, I was surprised that he shared this much with us -
> and I am sure he would NOT have, if the news media had properly covered
> the dedication.

......

>So now, Michael, we get to the heart of the matter.  I and my collegues
>applaud the American tradition of TRUTH - and your questioning
throughout
>our nation of claims of heroism is applaudable.  But I must ask why are
>you pursuing Mr. Ramsey's classified (but apparently not yet officially
>published) service record -- when there is substantial evidence that it is
>bonafide and when there is NO ONE to gain by telling an untruth.  I am
>sure there are claims that are worthy of pursuing, but this is not one of
>them - and I doubt all the DoD high-ups are going to wish to engage with
>you on a debate regarding Mr. Ramsey - I wouldn't ask them to!  More
>importantly, Michael, is the consumption of your time on this even worthy
>of what you COULD be doing for our newest Veterans in showing them
the
>proud tradition of Americanism that I truly believe Bernie silently
>portrayed?  I understand that (second hand -- I haven't asked for your
>service record, and heard only by word of mouth that may not be valid)
>that you were a POW - you are EXACTLY the type of veteran we wish to
have
>our newest veterans talking with.  What you must have endured speaks
>loudest for faith in God, Country, and the American way of life.  Can I
>interest you in coming to speak at our Legion on Americanism - why this
>country is head and shoulders above all the rest in LIVING the freedoms
>that other countries only pay lip-service to?  If I can convince you to
>come and visit, I will certainly try to talk that high-ranking government
>official that Bernie Ramsey rescued to attend and speak with you in
>private.  Under those circumstances, I am certain you mind will rest with
>the knowledge that while Bernie Ramsey himself never went through the
>indignities and demeaning treatment our POWs have endured, he was
and in
>his memory is a hero to reflect upon.

Jim Lenz

To: Lenz
Subject:  Bernard Ramsey, Jr.....Wannabe created by "friends"
CC: ...
 
Jim Lenz
1st Vice Commander
American Legion Post 7 - Annapolis
 
Mr. Lenz:
 
First...Thanks to you and all the FAA guys and gals who safely guided me
through the skies during my second career in civil aviation.  I retired off the
757/767 at UAL at age 60. 
 
My first career was with the Navy for a total of 28 1/2 years in uniform. 
Never have I heard a more fanciful story of BS as the farcical yarn told by
friends of Mr. Ramsey.  Mr. Patterson brings up a lot of valid points.  The
one additional point that I would bring up that no one has mentioned is: 
Please name just one name of those hapless souls who were rescued from
behind enemy lines.  No one can, because the situations described never
occurred.  By the way, I can't find a single valid point that you bring up. 
 
Please name the name of the "high official" who was rescued from a
captive situation.  You can't, because the event never occurred.  I suggest
you call Mr. Larry Greer, PAO for  DPMO in this regard.  He is info copied
on this message.  He is only a phone call away, during normal Washington
DC working hours, at: 703-699-1169.
 
The BS is so deep that in one article by Jennifer Carr, For the Captial, 29
July 2006 writes, "Mr. Ramsey and his team extracted approximately 179
U.S. servicemen from behind enemy lines in Vietnam, Laos and
Cambodia."  She can only get this type of hogwash from you guys, his
friends who provided her the information.  She didn't make it up, someone 
gave it to her.  Neither you nor any of his friends can give me a single
name of the 179.  I can give you the name, rank, address, etc. of every one
of the real 660 POWs.  Why can't you give me one name of the 179?
 
You see, I deal with facts, not fiction.  Mr. Greer at Defense Prisoner of
War/Missing Personnel Office deals with facts.  Mary at POW Network
deals with facts.  Michael Patterson deals with facts.  Facts can be verified. 
BS can be thrown around with abandon and never verified. 
 
You said in your letter, "...official representatives of the Department of
Defense read portions of his formerly classified service record."  Please
provide the names of these official representatives of DoD.  I'd like to ask
them where they got their information as I doubt that DoD would knowingly
endorse such a falsehood.
 
We, the real surviving 660 POWs of the Vietnam War can attest that there
was never a rescued POW (rescued by Ramsey, as you mentioned) with
us.  We had all the CIA and covert guys with us, and they are all listed by
DPMO in their PMSEA list.  They are current members of our organization,
NAM-POWs Corporation, a 501 (c) (19) veterans corporation for the former
POW of Laos, Cambodia, China, and Vietnam during the Vietnam War. 
There has never been a verified captive who was rescued other than those
listed on the PMSEA.
 
DPMO has the official list of all 3,797 names of MIAS (includes 30
escapees and 330 repatriated POWs) on their web site at:
 
I have been helping Mary at POW Network uncover over 1,400 frauds for
the past 8 years.  It is a shame that Mr. Ramsey's friends, aided by
American Legion Post 7-Annapolis, have held this guy's name up to
ridicule.  This horse sheiss stuff about classified service records being
declassified and read at funerals, classified missions that are still
classified, service in Vietnam that cannot be verified by official records, and
on and on, is just too much to fathom.  21-gun salutes for someone who
doesn't rate a 21 gun salute.  I don't think so.  The horse sheiss just gets
deeper and deeper.  Whoever started this mess and got Mr. Ramsey's
name up on a marquee for the whole world to laugh at should be ashamed
of himself.  I'm afraid that Mr. Ramsey's name will now properly be included
on Mary's list of wannabes.  The guy was probably just an ordinary guy who
did his honorable service for 20 years and retired.  For you guys to make
him out to be something he wasn't is just not right.  Let the guy and his
family rest in peace. 
 
My bottom line....you might have meant well, but it looks like the "extremely
high ranking government official (who IS still in a classified status)" and the
rest of you have pulled off a scam of the first degree. You should be
ashamed of yourself for pulling the offices of Lt. Governor Ehrlich, Senator
Mikulski, and Senator Sarbanes (i.e., their representative staff members
who attended) into this scam.  If I can find their e-mail addresses, I will info
copy them on this message.  Good luck explaining to them why you invited
them. 
 
Sincerely,
 
John M. McGrath, Captain USN (Ret)
POW in NVN for 5 years 8 months