Pilots in Pajamas - Part 1

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TRANSCRIPT OF THE GERMAN FILM, WAS NOT OBTAINED FROM THE USG
Column 1, is what is seen on the film
Column 2, is who is speaking
Column 3, is spoken TEXT from the film
PLEASE NOTE -- Some of the interrogation questions DO REPEAT, as tho duplicated, but are on separate consecutively numbered pages in the transcript... Spelling errors appear in the original

 

                   P I L O T S     I N     P Y J A M A S
                                     1
                             Y E S   :   S I R
                           Heynowski & Scheumann

1.                            THE PRODUCERS OF THIS FILM EXTEND
                              PARTICULAR THANKS TO THE COMRADES
                              OF THE VIETNAMESE PEOPLE'S ARMY AND
                              THE FILM STUDIES IN HANOI FOR THEIR
                              COMMRADELY ASSISTANCE.
2. & 3.                       THE QUESTIONS IN THE INTERVIEWS
                              WITH THE US AIR FORCE OFFICERS WERE
                              ASKED IN GERMAN AND TRANSLATED SI-
                              MULTANEOUSLLY.  THEY WERE DUBBED FOR THE
                              ENGLISH VERSION OF THE FILM.
4.                            -M u s i c-
Pilots climb
into their cockpits
5. 
Airplane taxies to the
take-off strip
6. 
Bombs falling
7.
Explosions                    Author's
on the                        commentary:     Vietnam-
ground
8.
People standing                               We have seen the attacks -
in front of buring
buildings
9.
A man holding a                               and their targets.
wounded child
10.
US airplane                                   We have seen the the murderers
                                              in the sky...
11.
Evcavation                                    and the victims on the ground.
of people burried
in rubble
12.
Planes in the sky                             What is inside these American
                                              bomb droppers?  What do the
                                              insides of their heads look
                                              like? We would like to ask
                                              them  - but up there, in
                                              their lofty heights,
                                              they are unreachable for us.
13. 
Pilots.                                       But now we are facing one
Close-up of eyes                              another, eye to eye with
                                              these bomb droppers
                                              from the USA; for -
14.
A rocket is prepared for                      Rockets  -
15.
A MiG takes off                               MiG's  -
16.
Anti-aircraft gun is loaded                   ack  - ack  -
17.
Militia with rifles                           and rifles  -
18.
Crash                                         brought them down to earth.
19.
Air defence fire                              Original sound
20.
A burning airplane            Commentary:     One  -
21.
A plane engulfed in                           Two  -
22.  
A burning plane barrel                        Three  -
rolls out of the sky
23.
An airplane explodes                          Four  -
24.
A burning airplane                            Five  -
25.
A burning airplane                            Six  -
26. 
A burning airplane                            Seven  -
27.
A buring airplane                             Eight  -
28.
A burning airplane                            Nine  -
29.
A burning airplane crashes,                   Ten American air pirates who
pilot ejects                                  survived the crash of their
                                              planes. They appeared in front
                                              of the cameras And microphones
30.
Montage:                                      of a film team from the German
Photos of the team (sound                     Democratic Republic, who were
engineer, cameramen, still                    the first such group in the
photographer, interpreter,                    world to be granted permission
editor; Heynowski & Scheumann)                by the Council of Ministers of
                                              the Democratic Republic of
                                              Vietnam to extensively query
                                              the prisoners - to ask them in
                                              the name of millions the world
                                              over: Why?
31.
Pan shot of the doors                         The prison camp cammanders
of the dention camp                           ascertained which pilots
                                              were prepared to speak and
                                              answer the questions.
32.
A pilot turns his back       Author's
to the camera                commentary:      This one here turned away as
                                              we came into his cell: he not
                                              only didn't want to be
                                              questioned, but also not
                                              filmed.  Was he filled with
                                              pride - or repentance?  Did
                                              he refuse because of self-
                                              confidence or shame?  We do
                                              not know. His prisoner's
                                              clothing-called "pyjamas"
                                              --  was the only thing we
                                              could film.
33.
Photographs of the                            Lieutenant-Commander Shumaker
capture of Lieutenant                         also refused to speak.  We
Commander Shumaker                            certainly would have liked to
                                              become acquainted with this
                                              pilot's pilot.  Because after
                                              all Shumaker, before being
                                              sent to Vietnam, was a
                                              back-up man in the American
                                              Astronaut group.
                                              But we know why he refused.
                                              His camp commander told us.
                                              Upon capture Schumaker fell
                                              down on his knees and cried
                                              for his life. We understand:
                                              The man is ashamed of himself.
34.
Photograph of the unknown                     These two, then, did not want
pilot and Shumaker side by                    to come
side
35.
Gallery of 12 faces; the two                 Two from a total of only 12
who refused are marked                       prisoners who had to be
                                             asked to attain 10 acceptances.
36.
Hubbard enters the room                      Even as prisoners they could
                                             decide themselves whether they
                                             wanted to come or not
37.
Shively walking along a path                 Not one of them looks like a
                                             war profiteer.
38.
Alvarez enters the room                      None of them give the
                                             impression of being a global
                                             strategist, who ponders about
                                             parts of the world and spheres
                                             of influence.
39.
Camera scans Terkelson,                      But never in the history of war
feet to face                                 have the monopoly bosses and
                                             their political
40.
Ringsdorf sits down                          representatives personally gone
                                             to
41.
Abbott sits down                             the battle fields.
42.
Thorsness enters the room                    Those who went were always the
and sits down                                same as as these.  And in those
                                             parts of the world  where
43.
Duart enters the room                        the mechanism of aggression
                                             functions, it functions
                                             through such people.
44.
Hughes, sitting                              We want to question them, want
                                             to become acquainted with them
                                             - but their
45.
Risner enters room and sits                  mere appearance before the
down                                         camera and microphone is
                                             not enough for this.
46.
Risner                                       We were fully aware of a risk
                                             for us:
47.
Backs of pilots heads                        Members of the American armed
                                             forces who fall - as they call
                                             it  - in "communist" captivity,
                                             are pledged to silence.   What,
                                             then, will our interview
                                             partners themselves say once
                                             sit down on
48.
The chair, empty                             this chair?  Every American
                                             Officer knows his pledge of
                                             silence.
49.
English text is faded in       Commentary:   "Code of Conduct" - Article 5:
50.
Insert:
Article 5                                     When questioned, should I
                                              become a prisoner of war, I
                                              am bound to give only name,
                                              rank, service number and date
                                              of birth. I will do the utmost
                                              of my ability.
51.
Camera scans the closed                       Keep your mouth shut - this is
mouths of the 10 pilots                       their order. Will they adhere
                                              to this? If so, we would not
                                              learn  - what's going on in
                                              their brains, how they think,
                                              what they feel, how they
                                              became what they are: namely
                                              air pirates. If they answer
                                              only the four questions
                                              allowed by the Code of Conduct
                                              then we would have made this
                                              6,300 mile journey to Vietnam
                                              only to shoot approximately
                                              one minute of film.
52.
Hubbard                                       Not we, but
53.
empty chair fades in                          those we interviewed had to
                                              make this decision.
54.
Hubbard, engineer fits                        This man was the first.  A few
the earphone                                  dials turned by our sound
                                              engineer: technical prepara-
                                              tions for understanding with
                                              our interpreter.    And, we
                                              begin.
55.
Pilot in cockpit                              - M u s i c -
56.
Title fades in                                Heynowski & Scheumann
57.
Title fades in                                PILOTS

58.
pilot in prisoner's clothing
walks along a path
59.
Title fades in                                IN PYJAMAS
60.
Hubbard
61.
Title fades in                                1
                                              YES, SIR
62.
Hubbard declares           X:                 We do not wish to conduct an
                                              interrogation but rather just
                                              chat with each other about
                                              your action as a pilot of the
                                              American armed forces against
                                              the Democratic Republic of
                                              Vietnam. I call your attention
                                              the fact that under the Code
                                              Conduct you are authorised to
                                              answer only four questions
                                              pertaining to your person.
                                              Everything over and above
                                              this is left up to your
                                              voluntary decision. Do we
                                              understand each other?
                           Hubbard:           Yes, yes, sir.
                           X:                 What is your name, please?
                           Hubbard:           Edward, I'm, ah, my name is
                                              Edward Lee Hubbard.
                           X:                 What is your rank?
                           Hubbard:           I am; First Lieutenant in the
                                              United States Air Force
                           X:                 What is your service number?
                           Hubbard:           Ah, my service number is FV
                                              3122827
                           X:                 Did you want to be a
                                              professional officer, or were
                                              you drafted?
                           Hubbard:           No, I, I enlisted in the Air
                                              Force. I was not drafted.
                           X:                 Of  your own free will then?
                           Hubbard:           Yes, sir.
                           X:                 What is your age?  When were
                                              you born?
                           Hubbard:           I was born on the 18th of May,
                                              1938, and I just had my 29th
                                              birthday.
                           X:                 Are you married?
                           Hubbard:           Yes, sir, I am married.
                           X:                 Do you have children?
                           Hubbard:           I have one little boy, named
                                              David Wayne.
                           X:                 Are you a member of a church?
                           Hubbard:           I'm a Protestant by faith.
                           X:                 Protestant, yes.  What
                                              education do you have?
                           Hubbard:           Just high school. I've just
                                              had high school. I have taken
                                              a few night school courses,
                                              college courses, but very few.
63.
Alvarez declares           Alvarez:           My name is Edward Alvarez,
                                              junior.
                                              My service number is 644124.
                           X:                 When did you join the Navy Air
                                              Corps?
                           Alvarez:           Oh, I came into the United
                                              States Navy in 1960.
                           X:                 Your rank is Lieutenant Junior
                                              Grade.
                                              Did you enlist in the Navy in
                                              1960?
                           Alvarez:           I joined of my own free will,
                                              yes. I was born December 23rd,
                                              1937. I live in Santa Clara,
                                              in California.
                           X:                 Are you married?
                           Alvarez:           Yes, I am married,
                           X:                 Do you have children?
                           Alvarez:           No, I have no children.
                           X:                 No children. -- Are you a member
                                              of any church?
                           Alvarez:           Yes, I am Catholic.
                           X:                 A Catholic.  And your education?
Pilot's helmet on the
the floor.  Pan shot       Commentary:        The man who owned this pilot's
of pilot                                      helmet was shot down shortly
                                              before being interviewed.
[64 NOT IN ORIGINAL DOCUMENT]
65.
Shively declares                              He was very willing to get
                                              dressed again, for the camera,
                                              in his pilot equipment.
                           Shively:           Sir, my name is James Richard
                                              Shively.
                           X:                 What is your Air Force rank?
                           Shively:           I am First Lieutenant. My
                                              service number is FR 78909.
                                              Sir, I was commissioned in
                                              1964, June of 64.
                           X:                 Were you drafted, or did you
                                              enlist of your own free will?
                           Shively:           Ah, I joined, I enlisted.
                           X:                 Then today you are considered
                                              to be a professional officer.
                           Shively:           Yes, sir.
                                              I'm 25 years old. I was born
                                              on the 23rd of  March, 1942.
                           X:                 Are you married?
                           Shively:           No, sir, I am not.
                           X:                 Do you have a fiancee waiting
                                              for you in the United States?
                           Shively:           No, sir.
                           X:                 Are you a member of a church?
                           Shively:           Ah, I'm a Baptist. Baptised in
                                              the Baptist Church.
                           X:                 What is your educational
                                              standing?
                           Shively:           Ah, sir, I had four years
                                              college at the United States
                                              Air Force Academy and I had
                                              approximately eight months
                                              graduate school at Georgetown
                                              University in Washington, D.C.
                                       
                           X:                 Did you obtain an academic
                                              degree from the University?
                           Shively:           Ah, yes, sir, I have a
                                              Bachelor of Science degree
                                              with a major in political
                                              science from the Air Force
                                              Academy and a Master's
                                              degree in International
                                              Affairs from Georgetown
                                              University.
66.
Ringsdorf declares         Ringsdorf:         Ringsdorf, Herbert Benjamin
                                              Ringsdorf, Sir.
                           X:                 When were you born?
                           Ringsdorf:         September 16, 1939.
                                              I am a First Lieutenant. FR
                                              15446.  I joined of my own
                                              free will.
                           X:                 Did you enlist for patriotic
                                              reasons, or what led you to
                                              join the Air Force?
                           Ringsdorf:         I wanted to be in the Air
                                              Force to fly, I wanted to
                                              learn to fly.
                           X:                 Are you married?  Do you have
                                              children?
                           Ringsdorf:         No, I am not married, no.
                           X:                 Is a girlfriend waiting for
                                              you in the United States, or
                                              do you have a fiancee?
                           Ringsdorf:         I have a fiancee, yes.
                           X:                 Did you intend to get married
                                              in the near future.
                           Ringsdorf:         When I got home we were
                                              planning on it.
                           X:                 Are you a member of a church?
                           Ringsdorf:         I am Methodist, Protestant.
                           X:                 How much education do you have?
                           Ringsdorf:         I have had four years of
                                              college.
                           X:                 Do you have an academic
                                              degree, or did you graduate
                                              from College?
                           Ringsdorf:         I have a Bachelor of Science
                                              in chemistry.
67.
Torkelson declares         Torkelson:         My name is Loren Harvey
                                              Torkelson.
                           X:                 What is your rank in the Air
                                              Force?
                           Torkelson:         Ah, First Lieutenant.
                                              FV 3155656.
                           X:                 Are you an Air Force career
                                              officer, or were
                                              drafted for service?
                           Torkelson:         Ah, well, I wasn't
                                              necessarily drafted. I am
                                              not actually a professional
                                              soldier. But I did have a
                                              military obligation.  I am
                                              just fulfilling a military
                                              obligation that is as is
                                              required by my country.
                           X:                 How old are you?  When were
                                              you born?
                           Torkelson:         I am 26. I got married on the
                                              4th of January this year.
                           X:                 4th of January, 1967?
                           Torkelson:         Yes, I did.
                           X:                 Then this vietnam assignment
                                              was sort of a honeymoon trip?
                                              How long were you together
                                              with your wife before coming
                                              overseas?
                           Torkelson:         Oh, after I got married,
                                              approximately 9 or ten days.
                           X:                 Are you a member of a church?
                           Torkelson:         I am a Protestant.
                           X:                 Tell us something about your
                                              education, please.
                           Torkelson:         Ah, well, I went through
                                              high school. I have
                                              A Bachelor degree. Four years
                                              of college at University of
                                              North Dakota.
                                              
68.             
Abbott declares            Abbott:            Robert R. Abbott.
                           X:                 What was your rank in the Air
                                              Force?
                           Abbott:            First Lieutenant.
                           X:                 What is your service number?
               
                           Abbott:            My service number, you mean?
                                              FR 81453
                           X:                 And today you are a
                                              professional officer,
                                              that is your job?
                           Abbott:            Yes, sir.
                           X:                 What is your age?
                           Abbott:            25.
                           X:                 Are you married?
                           Abbott:            Yes.
                           X:                 Do you have any children?
                           Abbott:            No, sir.
                           X:                 Are you member of a church?
                           Abbott:            What educational standing do
                                              you have?
                           X:                 I graduated from Michigan
                                              State University, Bachelor of
                                              Arts degree.
69.
Duart declares             Duart:              My name is David Henry Duart.
                                               When I was shot down I was a
                                               captain. I was promoted
                                               supposedly since that time to
                                               major.
                           X:                  This is the first time I've
                                               heard this. How do you know
                                               that during your period as a
                                               prisoner, in absentia so to
                                               speak, you were promoted to
                                               major?
                           Duart:              Ah, our promotion system,
                                               ah, a list of those to be
                                               promoted in the following
                                               year is put out in December.
                                               And I was informed that I
                                               had been promoted and in
                                               February, it's a number
                                               system. My number was so far
                                               down on the list. By the end
                                               of February when I was shot
                                               down, you could very
                                               easily figure out by how many
                                               they were promoting a month,
                                               approximately what month you
                                               would be promoted in. I
                                               figured out in my case that
                                               it would be probably in
                                               April, latest in May.
                           X:                  So that's the way it is. What
                                               is your service number?
                           Duart:              Foxtrott Victor 3057321 is my
                                               serial number. I am 32 years
                                               old.
                           X:                  Are you married?
                           Duart:              Yes, sir, I am married. I
                                               have three children. I am of
                                               Protestant faith. I am a
                                               graduate of high school in
                                               Pennsylvania.
70.
Thorsness declares         Thorsness:          My name is Leo Keith
                                               Thorsness. I am a Major in
                                               the Air Force.
                           X:                  What is your age, please, and
                                               when were you born?
                           Thorsness:          I am 35. I was born and
                                               raised the first 18
                                               years in Minnesota.
                           X:                  Are you a member of a church?
                           Thorsness:          I am a Lutheran.
                           X:                  Are you married, Major?
                           Thorsness:          Yes, I'm married and have
                                               one child.
                           X:                  Married and have a child. How
                                               about your education?
                           Thorsness:          I have a Bachelor's degree
                                               at, from the University of
                                               Omaha and I have a Master's
                                               degree from the University
                                               of Southern California.
71.
Hughes declares            Hughes:             I'm James Lindbergh Hughes.
                           X:                  Which rank did you have in
                                               the Air Foce?
                           Hughes:             Lieutenant Colonel. FR 43211.
                           X:                  When were you born, Colonel?
                           Hughes:             11 June 1927.
                           X:                  Are you married?
                           Hughes:             Yes.
                           X:                  Do you also have children?
                           Hughes:             Two.
                           X:                  Are you a member of a church?
                           Hughes:             Ah, Protestant. Methodist
                                               specifically.
                           X:                  How much educational
                                               training have you had?
                           Hughes:             Military, sir, or civilian,
                                               or a combination?
                           X:                  Civilian and military.
                           Hughes:             Yes, I have two civilian
                                               degrees, one from The
                                               University of Omaha, 1960,
                                               General Education, one from
                                               the University of New
                                               Hampshire 1965, Electrical
                                               Engineering. In the military
                                               I've been through numerous
                                               pilot training courses,
                                               depending on the aircraft
                                               that I was flying.
                           X:                  Colonel, you have an
                                               explanation to make for our
                                               viewers. Judging from your
                                               face you were obviously
                                               suffering from a skin
                                               disease, is that correct?
                           Hughes:             I have an allergy which has
                                               cropped up, new to me, we
                                               have yet to identify
                                               specifically the cause for
                                               it. We hope it's temporary.
                           X:                  We all are suffering here
                                               from the heat and we have on
                                               our arms and body that which
                                               you have on your forehead.
                                               The reason is simply that
                                               this country is extremely
                                               hot for what we are
                                               accustomed to.
                           Hughes:             I understand.  Thank you very
                                               much.
72.
Risner declares            Risner:             My name is Robinson Risner.
                           X:                  What is your rank in the
                                               American armed forces?
                           Risner:             I am Lieutenant Colonel in
                                               the US Air Force
                           Commentary:         Risner was promoted to
                                               Colonel while still a
                                               prisoner.  On the day of this
                                               interview, this was not yet
                                               known to him.
                           X:                  Your service number, please?
                           Risner:             Ah, 26905 alpha.
                           X:                  When, Colonel Risner, did you
                                               enlist in the Air Force?
                           Risner:             In 1943.
                           X:                  Would you tell us your age,
                                               please?
                           Risner:             Yes, I am 42.
                           X:                  Are you married?
                           Risner:             Yes, I have a wife and five
                                               boys.
                           X:                  Five boys. Would you tell us
                                               please the age of the
                                               youngest and the age of the
                                               oldest?
                           Risner:             Yes, the youngest one is six
                                               and the oldest one will be 19
                                               in August.
                           X:                  Colonel Risner, are you a
                                               member of a church?
                           Risner:             I'm a Protestant and Assembly
                                               of God.
                           X:                  How long did you go to school
                                               before you joined the armed
                                               forces?
                           Risner:             I was only a high school
                                               graduate, that is the
                                               limits of my education.
           
73.
Stills:
Portraits of the ten
pilots                   Commentary:           Professional officers - one
                                               the same as the other.
                                               Between 25 and 43 years of
                                               age. All of them have high
                                               school diplomas. Most of
                                               them were enrolled in
                                               universities, passed their
                                               exams and have academic
                                               degrees. Nearly all of them
                                               are married or engaged.
                                               Each is a member of a church.
                                               The personnel departments of
                                               the Air Force and Navy should
                                               be delighted with them.
 
74.
US pilot in cockpit        Author's            Machines of the American
                           commentary:         armed forces in use in
                                               Vietnam.
75.
Plane takes off                                represent a high technical
                                               standard.
76.
Plane takes off                                Not every pilot is capable of
                                               flying a Thunderchief or
                                               Phantom.
77.
Planes in the air                              Those selected to do so go
                                               through extensive training
                                               and must prove their
                                               ability in numerous flying
                                               hours.
78.
US pilot in cockpit                            For pilots flying against
                                               the DRV
79.
Refuelling maneuver in                         the difficult maneuver of
the air                                        hooking up in the air with
                                               a tanker is a routine matter:
                                               men and material are well
                                               acquainted.
80.
Shively declares           Shively:            I, I flew the F 105.
                           X:                  That is the Thunderchief?
                           Shively:            Yes, sir.
                    
81.
Thunderchief flying                            -   Original   sound   -
82.
Abbott declares            Abbott:             F 105, Excuse me, F 105.
                           X:                  This plane has such a
                                               sonorous name if I
                                               remember correctly.
                           Abbott:             Thunderchief.
83.
Thunderchief landing                           -   Original   sound   -
84.
Hughes declares            Hughes:             The F 105.
                           X:                  This is the Thunderchief, is
                                               it not?
                           Hughes:             Yes.
85.
Thunderchief flying                            -   Original   sound   -
86.
Duart decalres             Duart:              I was flying an F 105-F.
87.
Thunderchief taking off                        -   Original   sound   -
88.
Risner declares            Risner:             I was in a 105, F 105.
                           X:                  The Thunderchief, is that
                                               right?
                           Risner:             Yes, yes.
89.
Thunderchief taking off                        - Original sound  -
90.
Thorsness declares         Thorsness:          I flew the 105, sir.
                           X:                  That is the Thunderchief?
                           Thorsness:          Thunderchief.
91.
Thunderchief on runway                         - Orignial sound  -
92.
Ringsdorf declares         Ringsdorf:          I flew an F 4 C.
                           X:                  Isn't there another name
                                               generally used to
                                               describe this aircraft?
93. 
Phantom flying                                 - Original sound  -
94.
Torkelson                  Torkelson:         I flew an F 4 C.  Phantom.
                           X:                 A Phantom.  As far as I know
                                              that is the Pride of the Air
                                              Force.  One of the most
                                              modern airplanes, is that
                                              right?
                           Torkelson:         Ah, yes, sir, it is.
95.
Phantom flying                                -  Original  -
96.
Alvarez declares           X:                What type of airplane did you
                                             fly?
                           Alvarez:          A 4 C.
                           X:                There is another name for it,
                                             isn't there?
                           Alvarez:          Yes, "Skyhawk".
                           X:                "Skyhawk".
97.
Skyhawk takes off          Original          - Original sound  -
98.
Hubbard declares           Hubbard:          I flew an RB 66.
99.
Photo of model planes      Commentary:       One reconnaissance plane
                                             known as the RB 66  --
100.
Skyhawk                                      one "Skyhawk"  --
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